[Denis DNT]

I am sure I am not the only teacher who has noticed the recent rise in the use of electronic language dictionaries among my students. Sometimes I try to stop them but it frustrates them so much. When I allow them, my class discipline is highly affected and most of the students become lazier. What is even more disturbing is the fact that these dictionaries have other things like games. It becomes a hide and seek game to know whether the student is actually looking up a word or playing a game.
I am not against the computer age but I think something ought to be done.
What do you guys think?

[mesmark]

I think they're fine. I prefer a real ditionary with pages and stuff because it's easier to browse, but what is it that's bothering you? Just the fact that they might be playing games?

I've never seen anyone playing games with e-dictionaries in my classes. What king of games do they have? word games?

You could always define a time when dictionaries are allowed and when they're not. If they use the dictionaries to get their work done and play games after they've completed the exercise, it really doesn't matter. They got their work done, right? If they're not getting their work done then you need to initiate some sort of incentive or punishment system.

If they're playing games while you are teaching then I can see the problem and maybe you could fix that with a set 'dictionary time.'

[Denis DNT]

I get your point and I'd allow them to play games if some of the common games like 'Tetris' 'topedo' 'car racing' contributed in the learning process.
Dictionary yes but the electronic one, I am still to believe in it.
No need to mention some of the meanings they get which are totally different from what was intended for the student.

With all of them punching words to get the equivalent in their mother tongue I just get the feeling that it's more of a translation class than and English language class. There is very little effort to speak or understand anything in English becuase the little computer is there to spell out everything in the mother tongue.
I don't know if there is anyone out there with the same experience

[mesmark]

How many people are you teaching per class?

I assume you are dealing with a large class. In that case it's really difficult to answer everyone's vocabulary questions and spend the time demonstrating and/or explaining the word via oral English-English. Dictionaries are good tool in this case and the students can still be confussed by all the entries in regular dictionaries as well. Electronic dictionaries offer the users a lot more power in a lot less space - English-English, Japanese-English, Japanese-Japanese, Medical English, thesaurus and other functions.

If they're playing tetris or something like that, I would assume you need to enforce the same rule you would for cell phones or gameboys.

[HUE]

It comes down to how you allow the students to use the dictionaries, whether electronic or paper. If the students just check the word, and move on, they have zero retention. Similarly, if they only check the translation, then they miss much of the nuance. They may not even use the word correctly, because the translation just provides a list of synonyms (or, at least, Japanese dictionaries do).

If you want to get the most out of an electronic dictionary, encourage your students to guess the meaning of the word from context. Next, they can check the dictionary. If they're wrong, they'll want to know why. If they're right, then they feel good about themselves. In both cases, though, retention will be higher. Additionally, for intermediate and advanced students, English-English dictionary use should always be promoted.

[Denis DNT]

Oh yeah, that's exactly what I am talking about Hue. You get the point.
How much learning is it in punching this little machine all the time for translations of words? Ask these guys in middle school to write a simple paragraph. They write it out in Korean and then translate it using the little machines. You don't want to know what the translated version looks like; just nonsense. That's why I think these dictionaries should be allowed but not in class or more precisely let's say during tests, and serious class exercises that require personal effort from students.

Ever since I started worrying over this issue, I took time last semester to study these dictionaries closely and Oh my God! some of them offer weird meanings, translations, constructions and even pronunciations. Is there any serious follow up by language experts with the companies that make them and the source from which they get the stuff that they program into the machines?
Nevertheless, I have seen some great machines too. Versions like the ones you find on mobile phones here in china ought to be questioned really.

[HUE]

Almost all of my students use an electronic dictionary, although some punch in words on the cellphones. That gets old quick, though, and they splurge for one with the OED, a learner's dictionary, collocations, etc. But I've found the occasional mistake in these, too.

I've found that I can limit dictionary use by teaching just a little above their level, and also by incorporating enough opportunities for presentation, self-discovery, and use of the language in context. When the material is too difficult, students have no choice but to resort to the dictionary. That said, in a public school environment, you're working at the pace of the curriculum and not the students.

[DaveESL]

My students here in China are (apparently) too poor for electronic dictionaries. When I was in Taiwan / Hawaii, though, my classes were full of them. I agree with the zero retention problem but, I'm much more concerned with eliminating mp3 players and cell phones than dictionaries.

[Denis DNT]

This debate reminds me of the debate on using electronic calculators during Maths classes and exams. That was when i was in secondary school. It was hard for Maths teachers. Hardly did I know as an English teacher someday the same problem will come up.

[clivehawkins]

Quote Denis DNT

This debate reminds me of the debate on using electronic calculators during Maths classes and exams. That was when i was in secondary school. It was hard for Maths teachers. Hardly did I know as an English teacher someday the same problem will come up.

I'd go along with that!
One thing I remember clearly though is that we had to learn how to use it correctly otherwise you got yourself into all sorts of problems. OK, basic additions and subtractions were easy enough but other functions needed to be taught. I guess it's the same with electronic dictionaries. To really get the most out of it you need to know how to use it. I don't know how good they are these days, but what I prefer about paper ones is that you have the word, the phonetic spelling, the stress, the part of speech and then the definition, often with examples. I like to get my students to get the most out of the dictionary and not simply use it to get the meanings. I usually do a dictionary lesson at the start of each course so that during the year they become autonomous using it and less reliant on me to tell them what stuff means, how to pronounce it etc etc.

As for mp3 players, games etc I simply don't stand for them. They can rant and rave all they like but there's no way I'm having anybody in my class listening to music \ playing SuperMario 8 or whatever it's up to now. You've got to be kidding.

[Denis DNT]

As for mp3 players, games etc I simply don't stand for them. They can rant and rave all they like but there's no way I'm having anybody in my class listening to music \ playing SuperMario 8 or whatever it's up to now. You've got to be kidding.

That's the worry that inspired the debate topic. The first electronic dictionaries were very basic and useful, but with competition in that sector the manufacturers, I mean the designers now include all those extras in order to lead sales; music, games, alarm clocks, I can't name them all. Little do they know how much distraction they are providing the kids and how much trouble it means for us teachers.
Like the example of calculators I mentioned earlier, I remember there was this classmate of mine who had a Japanese made calculator that had some kind of fax. He could actually fax a maths problem to his brother who was in High School at the time. We became so excited about the idea and couldn't keep our secret. Our smart discipline mistress, late Miss Dube found out everything and seized the famous calculator before exams showed up. Jeez! Those days were fun!

As for these dictionaries we shall only have to learn to work with them.

[michèle 2]

[That's the worry that inspired the debate topic. The first electronic dictionaries were very basic and useful, but with competition in that sector the manufacturers, I mean the designers now include all those extras in order to lead sales; music, games, alarm clocks, I can't name them all. Little do they know how much distraction they are providing the kids and how much trouble it means for us teachers.
Yes, you're right the designers don't know how much distraction they provide in putting such "devices" on the market
Fortunately for me none of my students has an electronic dictionary!!

[Denis DNT]

And the pain is having to check each time on the little guy whether he is actaully checking out the meaning of a word or programming his alarm extra that will throw off your lesson a few minutes later with the sound of a police siren.

I was compelled to seize one just before the October holiday after three warnings. The guy's dictionary has this loud sound of laughter and clapping each time he wins a game or kills one of the heros in the games. I don't know whether it is download from the internet or it is actually part of the dictionary built-in.

You know what even gives them the most fun? The fact that old teachers like us from the other generation don't even know how to use these devices. I brought the one I seized to the staff room and we were all at a loss. No one could even turn it on. The guy had some password lock key or something.

[kisito]

Electronic dictionaries are generally bad for the classroom. Students just can't resist using them when they get new words. They could be used, provided there is some strict guidance at the start of the course as how and why we use dictionaries.Most often, without proper guidance it becomes frustrating when my students (who are quite keen to learn) head for their e-dictionaries when I have just only mentioned a new word. Sometimes it takes away focus from the subject as some new words are just introduced but not as part of that lesson ( I call them throw away words).This is when I get to ban them. Also, often using these dictionaries could mean that the students need some non-dictionary vocab learning skills. Read my article on this topic.